[VengefulRonin]

In my opinion (just my opinion, I'm not saying it's fact), Nomura's always been a pretty lame artist, his designs are always anime styled and the clothing and weapons are outlandish and ugly to look at. But XIII brings about a whole other level of lameness: complete and utter unoriginality. Is it just me, or do the mystery guy and Seifer look pretty similar?

ff13_image_mag_30.jpg 15-scarf-seifer.jpg

And how about this ship from XIII and the Alexander from XII?
03ffxiii_05.jpg 12-alexander.jpg

Plus, in my opinion, this is the WORST conceived weapon ever. It's like a freaking Swiss Army Knife:
final-fantasy-xiii-7.jpg final-fantasy-xiii-8.jpg final-fantasy-xiii-6.jpg

And is it just me or does Lightning look like Ashe with a different hair color? ...thoughts?

[FF_FrEaK]

I don't really know much of Nomura, but from what I see it's actually not that bad. I happen to like the way he designs the characters because I really like anime!! Ok now I will answer all of the questions you asked..

Seifer and Mystery Guy: In my opinion it really doesn't remind me of Seifer. However, the collars of the coats look rather similar and its white exactly like Seifer's. The hair color doesn't really affect likliness between them because there are many characters with blonde brownish hair.

The Ships: Well, I am unfamiliar with FFXII, but from what I see they do have the same basic shape. Of course they would not keep the exact same ship unless they were putting some of XII's chracters in XIII, but I highly doubt that.

Lightning and her weapon: Does Lightning look like Ashe?? Well yes sort of...I think they are doing the same thing that FFVIII did. They kinda based Rinoa's character off of Tifa, so they might be doing it again for FFXIII.

You don't like her weapon?? I think it's actually pretty cool. It's kinda like Cloud's sword except Lighting's weapon doesn't seperate. To see that her gun thing can change into a sword is pretty awesome to me. I dont just don't think her weapon is the worst...there are far worse weapons than that.

I know I sort of went into details a bit, but I'm in art so details is a big part of my life.

[Andromeda]

Nomura said that when he was asked to make Lightning they told him to make a female version of Cloud. And in a while she actually looks more like Cloud then Ashe. She has the sweater turtle neck thing going that Cloud has. While Cloud has spike blonde hair she has normal wavey strawberry blonde hair as they seem to be calling it. But if you look at Lightning and Cloud. Cloud is obviously anime style, spiky hair and an insanely huge sword. Lightning is more normal, she has a realistic hair style and a weapon that is actually a little more practical and manageable. Nomura is known for making anime style characters, but how many RPGs from Japan do you know that do the same thing. If anything Lightning is going away from the anime style.

As for the mysterious man, he is a wearing a trench coat and happens to have blonde hair. Unless I see a scar on his face I'm not going to say that he is a copy of Seifer. There was similarities, but I'm hardly going to say that he is unoriginal from one image.

As for the airship designs, you cannot even see most of the first airship with the clouds masking a lot of it. There is a very vague similarity, but without actually seeing the rest of it they are just two airships. The design is actually far more organic than they usually do for airship designs. So I think it is quite a change from the designs that they have been going with.

[VengefulRonin]

Originally Posted by FF_FrEaK

You don't like her weapon?? I think it's actually pretty cool. It's kinda like Cloud's sword except Lighting's weapon doesn't seperate. To see that her gun thing can change into a sword is pretty awesome to me. I dont just don't think her weapon is the worst...there are far worse weapons than that.

Kind of like the Buster Sword only it doesn't separate? o_O Wha..? Are you talking about that piece of crap he had in Advent Children? And Lightning's sword is way thinner. What it reminds me even more of than a Swiss Army Knife are these Craftsman Leatherman multi-tools:

Attachment 15765

Originally Posted by Andromeda

Nomura said that when he was asked to make Lightning they told him to make a female version of Cloud.

Well then that's just unoriginality on SE's part, and yet another example of whoring out characters and giving into fandom. "HAI GUISE I BEEN READING FANFICS WE SHULD MAKE A GURL CLOUD!"

As for the mysterious man, he is a wearing a trench coat and happens to have blonde hair. Unless I see a scar on his face I'm not going to say that he is a copy of Seifer. There was similarities, but I'm hardly going to say that he is unoriginal from one image.

Yeah, he's wearing a trench coat the same color as Seifer's, the collar is flipped up the same way, he has blonde hair, and from what I can tell is standing in the same pose as Seifer, only facing the other direction. When I first saw that pic the first thing that entered my mind was "seifer!" It may be coincidental, but there are too many coincidences. And don't even get me started on that guy Storm. It's Cloud all over again, just with short gray hair and red eyes.

As for the airship designs, you cannot even see most of the first airship with the clouds masking a lot of it. There is a very vague similarity, but without actually seeing the rest of it they are just two airships. The design is actually far more organic than they usually do for airship designs. So I think it is quite a change from the designs that they have been going with.

True, there could be a longer section behind those clouds, but the general curvature is pretty similar. Also kinda reminds me of Boba Fett's ship Slave II. And I don't see how it's more organic, it looks pretty mechanical and alien to me. Is that just some hokey art term? I looked the term up on Miriam Webster, and the only thing that even comes close is this the fourth term http://m-w.com/dictionary/organic and sub-definition B is the only one that would work, and that term is so broad it could apply to anything.

[Silver]

I actually think Nomura is a great artist myself...
Sure I loved Amano's works, but Nomura is pretty good at what he does too. His slightly offbeat style, notice for details (SeeD Uniforms, most of the cast of FFX) and preference of 3D renders to sketches do tend to give the Final Fantasy games he's worked on some charm...

Even lesser seen characters such as Jecht have been made to look genuinely brilliant.
I see what you mean about the trench coat thing, but I wonder if it's just a purposeful nod to Seifer. I mean seriously, most if not all FFs have references to others...

The only major similarity between Storm and Ashe I can see is the clothing, and then that is just the top half of what she is wearing...
And I do like that weapon of hers too...

I think the biggest worry I have about FFXIII is that the story and use of characterisation with be reminiscent of that used in FFXII...

[VengefulRonin]

Originally Posted by celtic_silver

Even lesser seen characters such as Jecht have been made to look genuinely brilliant.

You can't be serious... Jecht looks like the white trailer trash I see around here, not at all brilliant. Unless of course where you live you have no white trailer trash, in which case he would seem exotic.

I see what you mean about the trench coat thing, but I wonder if it's just a purposeful nod to Seifer. I mean seriously, most if not all FFs have references to others...

There's a difference between references and making the characters so similar to each other that they look like they could be brothers. Besides, VIII isn't exactly the best game to reference anyway <.<

[Mistress Victoria]

Jecht in no wa--...Oh wait, I'm thinking of Auron, nevermind. -_-;
Yes. Jecht looks like homeless trailer trash. I agree on that. But he was still designed fairly well. I'd like to see you do better.

[Merlin]

Since the release of FFVII, Square/Squeenix has been notorious for rehashing the same story/graphics ideas over and over. Its more shocking that you find it shocking than it is that they are still doing it. It wouldn't be so noticeable if the series were all based on one planet. Its blatantly obvious because they are reusing the same artists/writers to create new worlds which implement features that other worlds in the past have. The possibility of coming up with the same idea more than once is pretty high in such a scenario. Either that or the staff is simply out of ideas(for quite some time).

I'm not saying I hate FF... far from it. But the simple fact is, they do regurgitate material, they are doing it, and will continue to do so in the future. Like it or love it, thats the way the cookie crumbles.

[VengefulRonin]

Originally Posted by Toph Bei Fong

Jecht in no wa--...Oh wait, I'm thinking of Auron, nevermind. -_-;
Yes. Jecht looks like homeless trailer trash. I agree on that. But he was still designed fairly well. I'd like to see you do better.

Give me a How to Draw Anime for Dummies book and a day or two of practice and I might be able to. Maybe. I certainly wouldn't dream up trailer trash <.<

Originally Posted by Merlin

Since the release of FFVII, Square/Squeenix has been notorious for rehashing the same story/graphics ideas over and over. Its more shocking that you find it shocking than it is that they are still doing it. It wouldn't be so noticeable if the series were all based on one planet. Its blatantly obvious because they are reusing the same artists/writers to create new worlds which implement features that other worlds in the past have. The possibility of coming up with the same idea more than once is pretty high in such a scenario. Either that or the staff is simply out of ideas(for quite some time).

I'm not saying I hate FF... far from it. But the simple fact is, they do regurgitate material, they are doing it, and will continue to do so in the future. Like it or love it, thats the way the cookie crumbles.

Oh I'm not shocked by it at all. I would expect them to at least be smart enough to make the rehashing less obvious though...and as you said, they keep using the same artists. I was surprised they even had Yoshida do XII, they seem to be in love with Nomura.

[Silver]

I stand by what I said concerning Jecht.
Maybe Aussie 'Trailer Trash' looks different...
(Mainly flannel shirts, ripped jeans combos and thongs).

He had the facial hair and mentality of some, granted, but he also had a better side to him, and the facial hair would most likely have been reflective of his own journey...
And don't forget, he as a character was a famous sportsman with a good home and wife.
It was in the character...

Have you ever seen a Jecht-like non main character before Jecht I wonder?
I sure haven't...

[VengefulRonin]

Originally Posted by celtic_silver

And don't forget, he as a character was a famous sportsman with a good home and wife.
It was in the character...

Have you ever seen a Jecht-like non main character before Jecht I wonder?
I sure haven't...

Nope, I haven't. Then again, I don't really think sports players and soccer ripoffs fit into RPGs that well. But anyway, this isn't about Jecht, it's about lame things in XIII, so without further ado I bring you this motivational poster I just made:

XIIIposter.jpg

Picture is taken from here: http://www.finalfantasyxiii.us/final...zine-cuttings/
Please tell me I'm not the only one getting sick of seeing cards in videogames. A minigame like Tetra Master is one thing, but when one of the first scans from a game has a character (probably a main character too) holding cards...I worry.

[Mistress Victoria]

What's wrong with cards? I like cards. And Yugioh is awesome when it's uncut. The manga is so dark it's not funny.

But anyway, it'd better believe in the Heart of the Cards if it wants to win. XD
Seriously though, I'm not sick of cards at all, since a particular TCG is one of my hobbies.

[Andromeda]

You also realize that it is FFXIII Agito for the cellphone, meaning Japan only game. This game won't see the light of day outside of Japan. So you really should not be getting upset. But the game is based around cards, it is pretty much Yugioh GX FF style. It is something that the Japanese are into and I'm pretty sure they know that.

I would say focus on the main FF game rather than the side games that have even less importance. FFXIII is the main game, but there are going to be a lot of additional independent games to go on in the world/universe of XIII.

[Skai]

Who the heck is Storm?

[Silver]

Originally Posted by VengefulRonin

Nope, I haven't. Then again, I don't really think sports players and soccer ripoffs fit into RPGs that well. But anyway, this isn't about Jecht, it's about lame things in XIII, so without further ado I bring you this motivational poster I just made:

Attachment 15767

Picture is taken from here: http://www.finalfantasyxiii.us/final...zine-cuttings/
Please tell me I'm not the only one getting sick of seeing cards in videogames. A minigame like Tetra Master is one thing, but when one of the first scans from a game has a character (probably a main character too) holding cards...I worry.

Sorry dude, I had you wrong...
I thought it was a Nomura bashing thread, and I just happen to like his designs...

Anyways, I'll pay you that motivational poster.
Those card based games are getting more and more frequent...
I loved the card games of earlier FFs, and KH:CoM was also a delight, but I get the feeling I'll get more than a little sick of them if the mobile game is released here...

Am I too traditional in my wants though, I wonder?
I was seriously way more excited for FF Advance games then FFXII...

I'm flipping with how I think FFXIII will turn out. I'm hoping it revives my interest, but after FFXII...
I really dunno where the FF series is headed...
I guess if worse comes to worst, I'll just go over to Dragon Quest completely...
It keeps the traditional RPG aspects real...

[Priscilla]

I personally think while they do look kind of similar. I don't think they resemble eachother enough to freak out over. Besides there are a lot of characters out there that resemble one another. A lot of anime characters resemble one another. If it works they are going to reuse it and again and again..

I like his art anyway.

[Walter Sobchak]

Originally Posted by Toph Bei Fong

I'd like to see you do better.

Thats a terrible argument. You don't need to draw to criticize art, just like you don't need to play an instrument to criticize music or act to criticize actors. The work created is meant for us to either like or dislike.

Amano was better, by far, but Nomura is here to stay. I liked what he did in VII, and even in VIII, but he continues to re-use designs. Part of that has to do with the fact that his characters are mostly human and not fantasy like Amano's, but there are a lot of different looking people.

Everything I have seen of XIII looks like it has been done before.

[sora_hinamori]

i`m agree too...
i better think that lightning was just like yuna but in different sides..
it is absolutely not look like ashe...her face, i think, is more like man`s face...

[Zargabaath]

I never have found Nomura to be a lame artist, I have found him to be quite good and puts a lot of effort into his designs. In FFVIII he made Squall have the fur on top of his coat to challenge the developing team. In FFX he made Tidus' hair layered and to have tons of belts on Lulu's outfit to challenge the development team to show off their prowess.

At first glance Snowe does look similiar to Seifer but after new media images of Snowe it is safe to say that Snowe is distinct from Seifer. Seifer had a vest underneath the trench coat, Snowe has button down shirt. Snowe has facial hair, Seifer lacks facial hair. Seifer has a short cut hair, Snowe's hair is chin lengthed. Seifer has no head wear Snowe has bandana.

The ship does look similiar even though it was pointed out that the back is covered up. But take a look at the airships from the first 5 FFs. They all had the same design; they could have made small changes too them. They look similiar but I'm not going to bring the cataclysm to Krynn because of it.

I like the weapon it is more of a gunblade than Squall's; his released a shockwave not an actual bullet. Her's can change between a gun and a sword it leaves for an interesting style of combat. One I desire to play.