View Poll Results: Time Loop Theory? (Spoilers)

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  • I believe it

    4 36.36%
  • I don't believe it

    4 36.36%
  • I'm not sure or I don't know enough about it

    3 27.27%
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Thread: Time Loop Theory?

  1. #1
    Registered User Locke4God's Avatar
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    Time Loop Theory?

    I was wondering how many of you believe in the time loop theory of FFVIII.

    For those who may not know, (SPOILERS) the theory goes that Rhinoa actually grows up to be Ultimacia who of course we already knew appeared from the future to attack our heroes. But you never know exactly why, and so it's theorized that in a previous time loop Rhinoa had gone crazy for some reason, turning Squall into her personal Guardian Force and then attempting to correct events of the past to her own liking. Some more detailed theories flesh out more than several iterations of the time loop and further explain why a future Rhinoa would want to manipulte the past (or present period of time in which the game is played out).

    I for one fully believed that after Ultimacia was revealed as from the future and then proceeded to use a GF with obvious connections to Squall that she was indeed Rhinoa. There is a key scene when they're out in space where Rhinoa tells Squall while they're alone something very sinister if you already suspect that Ultimacia is actually Rhinoa. If you don't suspect her, then it sounds much more innocent. Go replay the game and check that out.

    But I don't know. What do you think?
    Last edited by Locke4God; 09-03-2009 at 11:24 AM.

  2. #2
    Fun? What is this "fun" thou speakest of? Dodie16's Avatar
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    Haha, I was wondering when you were going to create this thread. Now I have a chance to properly respond to that post of yours from a different thread.

    This is an interesting theory, I give it credit for that. However, I don't think that the Ultimecia=Rinoa theory has any substantial proof to back it up, (other than speculation from fans), since the game never really goes into much detail about Ultimecia herself.

    I would have liked for you to have put in that conversation between Rinoa and Squall, so I could see what exactly you are talking about. I don't have the kind of time (or patience) to go through three disks just to see one conversation.

    So to answer your question, no I don't believe in the Time Loop theory because there just isn't enough information provided in the game for me to believe such a thing. If you want to believe it, then by all means do so. It gives Ultimecia the backstory that she so desperately needs to be a well developed character (imo). However, I remind you all that stuff like this makes for fanfiction fodder.
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  3. #3
    attempting to bribe the Mayor of Lambeth Xanatos's Avatar
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    Deleted my last post because suden change of mind.

    This isn't like me at all, I never deleted my post before but because of few circumstances I'm changing my opinion about this subject.


    Well I was searching the net and the facts that back up this theory are simply too amazing and I couldn't just ignore them. The most important thing is that Square actually did confirmed Ultimecia-Rinoa theory. Well Locke it seem that this isn't theory any more Rinoa is actually Ultimecia and well when you look at it a little better it all makes sense. Here is some information from FF WIKI:


    Rinoa becomes a Sorceress partway through the game. Sorceresses in the world of Final Fantasy VIII are prone to becoming evil and wreaking terrible destruction; at the time of the game, the world is just recovering from a conflict known as the Sorceress War. Concerned, Rinoa goes to Edea Kramer, a former Sorceress herself, for advice. Edea explains that Sorceresses can easily become corrupted by their power, but that this can be avoided by relying on the support of friends. In particular, Edea advises Rinoa to find a Knight who can offer her emotional support. Rinoa's love interest, Squall Leonhart, volunteers to be her knight.

    Based on this conversation, one theory suggests that the evil Sorceress Ultimecia is actually a future version of Rinoa, driven mad by grief after Squall's death, who intends to compress time as a way of regaining her beloved.

    Others claim that Ultimecia is in fact a future Rinoa, based on several hints within the game such as the fact that Ultimecia's GF bears the same name (Griever) as a ring that Squall gives to Rinoa during the course of the game. However, before fighting Griever, Ultimecia claims to attach to one of the party members (Squall). It can be assumed that, in doing so, Ultimecia's GF or, in fact, Ultimecia herself takes a part of Squall which he holds close - the Griever emblem. As such, it should also be noted that Griever is not only part of the ring which Squall gave to Rinoa but is, also, presumably, the lion head at the end of his keychain and on part of his many belts.

    In regards to the Rinoa/Ultimecia theory, however, it should be mentioned that the two share near identical facial structures in FMV sequences (which is emphasized by the final shot of Rinoa's face within the game, which flashes several times to Ultimecia's). Furthermore, Rinoa and Ultimecia are the only two Sorceresses who are shown to have wings--Rinoa grows white wings for her Angel Wing Limit Break, and Ultimecia possesses black wings when you meet her at her castle. Due to the Knight references throughout the game, it can be expounded that as her friends died around her, Rinoa became dark and twisted and yet Squall kept his promise to be beside her always. As such, he became Griever.

    There is also a possibility that Sorceress Adel's powers--which were given to Rinoa upon Adel's death--may have carried some of Adel's evil with them, which perhaps began to corrupt Rinoa even before the game was over. Upon Squall's death, Rinoa, driven mad by grief, might have opened herself fully to the evil in the power she had inherited, and could have even become so possessed by the Sorceress Power that it recreated her body as a malleable structure of pure magic that could survive long enough to reach the time when it decided to call itself Ultimecia and eliminate all other matter.

    This theory is attractive because it provides Ultimecia with the depth, background, and motivation that many felt she lacked, but the evidence supporting it is purely circumstantial. Some point out that if Ultimecia wanted to regain Squall, she probably wouldn't have tried to kill him.

    Square has directly stated that Rinoa is definitely Ultimecia.

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  4. #4
    Fun? What is this "fun" thou speakest of? Dodie16's Avatar
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    And your point is?

    I looked through that site as well, and I didn't see Square state anything that Rinoa is indeed Ultimecia. Only someone saying that they did. No links to an OFFICIAL statement was provided. So, I still stand by my decision that Rinoa and Ultimecia are not the same person.

    Here's a link to the same site as to what Xanatos-444 found. It's the discussion page, and if you scroll down to the part where it talks about the Rinoa-Ultimecia theory, you'll notice something quite interesting.

    Talk:Ultimecia - The Final Fantasy Wiki has more Final Fantasy information than Cid could research
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  5. #5
    Registered User Locke4God's Avatar
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    Guys, I'll see if I can find that line of dialouge I mentioned in the opening statement, so check back. It was a really creepy line that seemed very very suspicious. I'll get back to you.

    As to whether or not Square confirmed the identity, I have heard/read, but have not seen for myself that there is apparently a handbook on the sorceresses that specifically states that there is no connection between the two. It is also supposedly written by the games producers.

  6. #6
    attempting to bribe the Mayor of Lambeth Xanatos's Avatar
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    Even tho the theory sounds interesting it seems that I'm wrong big time, and Ultimecia is just a final boss with no good background story which is lame if you ask me. I must thank Dodie for pointing this out, I would actually believed that this theory is true and that Square confirmed it. Well this is my own fault for not researching a little better, sorry Locke it seems that Dodie was right all the time.

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  7. #7
    Registered User Locke4God's Avatar
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    @ Xanatos - You make a good point, that if in fact she has no backstory, then she would seem rather lame. The fact that they so blantantly leave out any backstory for her though only adds fuel to the theory that she is Rinoa, which if true would provide an amazing backstory. But as noted there's no concrete proof, but with no other story to plug in for her, there seems to be a major void in the game as you said.

  8. #8
    Ovaries GypsyElder's Avatar
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    I actually don't know what to think of this theory. To tell the truth I had no idea it even existed until today. I've looked into it a little and I'm kind of on the fence.

    But don't you think that if Rinoa really was Ultimacia, that they would take the time to explain it in the game? to me that would be a huge twist, and I don't think they would expect everyone who played, to figure out a plot gap that huge.

    If it's not true, then yes Ultimacia would be pretty lame, but not the first boss of a FF to not have a lot of background. FFX's Yu Yevon just randomly poped up, As did Exdeath in FFV and Necron in FF IX. Necron dissapointed me even more so than Ultimacia. At least she had SOME part in the plot unlike Necron who you just end up fighting and don't know of him at all until literally the final battle.
    Last edited by GypsyElder; 09-05-2009 at 04:16 PM.

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  9. #9
    Registered User Locke4God's Avatar
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    @ Tenseiken - You know I often wondered like you are, why they wouldn't just come out and say that Rinoa was Ultimacia if it was true, but then I thought about Ultimacia's use of Greiver as her GF, with the obvious tie to Squall, and then it occurred to me that it was actually a more interesting ending if they just left it up to you to figure out. If they told you, well then that's it, but if you have to figure it out, then it reminds you that the characters themselves don't know, Ultimacia herself had forgotten as GF's make you forget, and it just adds this fun layer of mystery with just enough hints to lead you to believing it.

    I thought Yu Yevon was actually built up pretty well. He was an ancient and very powerful Summoner who was on the losing end of Bevelle's battle with Zanarkand. You're right though they didn't spend a ton of time fleshing him out, but I liked it.

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