Writers Academy (Previously Demonia) - Page 11

Prodigal Madness · 01-24-2008, 08:05 PM

Realism needs to be thrown out. Make it description or something...but this is magic, or whatever the person uses. No where did the tourny say this was to be realistic. And do not, I'm not just complaining... I got 10/10 on that. =/ Especially annoyed with Toph's score though...got docked points off this for staying true to her character...?

Quote:

Your technique kept me feeling fascinated, I was anticipating the next post but it never came, hence -1 mark, also another mark was lost due to the dark purple's usage. A more neutral colour would've been better owing to the bulk of TFF using the 'Dark' Skin

-1 for not posting? How's that have to do with technique? Also, if anything, the color should be a bonus to my score. I added extra. That's my character(s) color. Almost always do that. Just cause the "bulk"(which how do you know this btw?) use dark skin isn't my problem. =/ Also, there are two people with a score for this rating, but no reason why...

I'm curious as to how Red got a higher score than me... Perhaps you need to go back and read it? He didn't attack once, and got a 4... I got a 2 for doing a basic attack(which isn't supposed to be HIGHLY detailed, but that's cool)... Xeim got a 0...due to no combat having taken place... Which I fail to understand. Loses points cause the opponent never posted? Summons aren't allowed... No where does the BA say making copies of yourself(which in Toph's case is illusion with a spell on it) is illegal. Innovative attack. Got docked points... DH, no offense...modded by cutting the "strings" to the clone(s) when no strings to them were mentioned in the post. Sorry, but adding in effects on what an opponent is doing is moddish. Don't see how DH's attacking giving little room for dodging is bad either. That's smart fighting. =/

Post flow is likewise harsh for getting a 0 for no opponent replying. Also, how can you comment I did bad by not connecting to Red's post when he MODDED in my character when I'd yet to make an intro? If anything, points should have been docked from Red for that. I had made no 2nd reply as he didn't describe the explosion(or anything resulting from that) as I had stated in my spell, nor attacked back. I can understand getting a 0 for not replying when he had.

Again, Use of Envio seemed bad... Xeim, as you say, describes it well...BUT due to their opponent not posting, you only give a 3? Not really fair when beyond their control. Myself, DH, and Toph got fairly low scores with no reason...of which, in my own opinion, we all used/described the zones quite well. =/

Penalties... No offense... Completely stupid. That's what the SCORING is for. The score should reflect the "offense" in the section it goes under... Not deducted from the point score AND get an additional hit after.

Also... Hyz. Why are you complaining about someone complaining? You're doing the same thing you're saying they shouldn't. Toph, at least, has a reason for it. Your post could be considered flame baiting since you're complaining about their post for, basically, no reason. =/

Xeim · 01-24-2008, 09:31 PM

Wows. This has turned into another minefield... >_< Now, first off, I agree with the arguements at hand. The judging method was flawed. However, let's not all just gang up on Aerif! No judging method was specified so Aeif just came up with something he thought would work (assumption).

Now look at it this way for a second. What is this club full of? Creative people. Some of us already have a way of getting that creativity out in legiable form. Others..are still working on it but it's still there! Now, the problem with creative people (espiecally those who are good at spinning their words)? They like THEIR ideas. And so, when you throw a bunch together....They rip each other apart until they figure out that maybe everything isn't so terrible after all.

So, if we don't figure this out....the club will keep repeating the same fate over and over. Leadership has absolutely nothing to do with it.

Here we have a bit of a flawed judging method. Let's not go ripping each other to pieces over it! My suggestion would be to come up with a sound way to do it. Eliminate pointless catagories, add some in....but as a club....with a reasonable attitude towards the whole thing. And, if you have to sacrifice part of your idea so everything moves along...don't get yourself banned over it. ^^;

Look at the tournament this way- it's our first time writing together. Sure not everyone's participating, but a lot of people are. So, it's a good way for us to get the hang of how we work together. Each "complication" we run into is not some "great-unforseen-wall-that-shall-tear-the-club-apart." It's a...well....how would one put this...good thing. So that we can unify the club a little more. You know?

Now, I know this post will get torn apart for staying relatively calm...but haha....it's merely a suggestion. If you lot want to go at it like wolves be my guest! I'm just here to try and reason!

^_^;

Xeim off to hide in a corner...

--Xeimy--

Aerif · 01-25-2008, 01:49 AM

In case you haven't all noticed by now, I'm judging by your standards of work, therefore to make slightly more fairer to the underdog. I'm presenting the judging in forms of points to make it easier for myself and to show you where you went wrong, you may not agree with some catergories or with penalties, however I can garauntee that judging without points is the same, the judges think of what's happening, what shouldn't be done and whether they should be penalised.

Writing is an important part of RPB. However so is the battle part, a balance must be acheived. I could always omit the points part but it's the easiest way to show what the judge thought of the posts.

Argument Heated = Yes

Toph, I don't think there's any need to start swearing at a descision you don't like, offer freindly suggestions and they would've been followed. But instead you decided to get angry, as shown in the tone of your writing.

Everybody, just calm down, you wanted results and you got them, they might not be expected but a little tweaking is needed to make a match fair. If the best writer won every time due to another's incompetence (this is just an example) then it wouldn't be fair. My criteria tries to make it fair.

Hyzenthlay · 01-25-2008, 06:53 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Prodigal Madness
Also... Hyz. Why are you complaining about someone complaining? You're doing the same thing you're saying they shouldn't. Toph, at least, has a reason for it. Your post could be considered flame baiting since you're complaining about their post for, basically, no reason. =/

Actually that's pretty much all you are doing. If you wernt you wouldnt have written at all. This whole discussion is about judging and I'm entitled to an oppinion as much as anyone else.

None of you had a problem with Aerif judging before this and she's judged other things. The fact that she gave you low scores is making you angry? Get the hell over it, if I lose then at least I know next time where to improve even if it is a little more... ingenuity.

As I said before all of you are dancing around things like "why have you deducted point for this" and "why did you knock off one for this". The fact is, she didnt consider your post good enough to get full marks, whatever reason that's for. A 9 out of 10 is good enough anyway.

Quote:

Originally posted by Xeim
Eliminate pointless catagories, add some in....but as a club....with a reasonable attitude towards the whole thing.

Yeah, finally a productive response. As a club we should work out the kinks, I never said Aerif judging was perfect, but maybe she can work on that too? Writing club, judging can be part of that. Aerif judging at some points was a bit too harsh, but it's a judgement non-the-less so stop whining, especially if you won already.

I gave my oppinion on some of the posts before Aerif and I pointed out alot of the things she did, so it's not like you hadn't heard some of it already. Why jump on her when she has a bigger responsibility than any of you? Get over yourselves, you arnt award winning authors or you wouldnt be here. Take the comments in your stride and work on the bad things next time.

Anyway, yay. My judgement is up tonight. It was nice fighting with you darkwolf =]. Thanks.
And, whoever hasnt poste dup their inner Rp profile. Do it soon, =].
Who is the judge of the next tourny rounds, too?

Aimee.

Storm · 01-25-2008, 07:37 AM

Hello again.

I appologise for being very inactive, when I thought workload would be coming down it sky-rocketed and had assaignments coming out of my ears. And media and multimedia assaignments aren't things that can be rushed or put on last minute like 1000 word essays. I'm not going to say i'll be active straight away just incase theres a second wave, but since it seems things are underway with the tournament I shall stay out of things for the time being and just observe. Thanks for forefeitting me though, Aerif, theres no way I would of been able to do anything with everything else that was going on and its unfair to have my busyness keeping everyone else down.

I guess this is sort of a post to say "don't worry, I halven't keeled over yet!"

*Mistress Sheena* · 01-25-2008, 11:18 AM

Here's some friendly advice for you.
Ever wondered how the TOA is judged? This is important, so please read. Use this. >_>;

And I'm sorry that I swore. But even though I did, that's still relatively tame compared to how angry I can get. ^^;

You say you did it on our standards of work, but all I really see for the majority (at least in the comments), are things you liked and didn't like about something. =\ Can't really improve someone's writing by only doing things you like.

And it just occurred to me right now. About the world DH and I were fighting in. I wasn't realistic to the world, you said, because I had an MP3 player.

But if you remember, the world itself is in the Avatar world. ...Our characters' existences alone are a paradox to the "realism" of the world. My character operates on the Naruto physics. DH's character is completely original. So, hey, why not just add an MP3 player. >_>; Although it's kind of interesting you bypassed the spaceship. =P

But anyway... there's that.

Prodigal Madness · 01-25-2008, 03:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aerif

In case you haven't all noticed by now, I'm judging by your standards of work, therefore to make slightly more fairer to the underdog. I'm presenting the judging in forms of points to make it easier for myself and to show you where you went wrong, you may not agree with some catergories or with penalties, however I can garauntee that judging without points is the same, the judges think of what's happening, what shouldn't be done and whether they should be penalised.

Writing is an important part of RPB. However so is the battle part, a balance must be acheived. I could always omit the points part but it's the easiest way to show what the judge thought of the posts.

Everybody, just calm down, you wanted results and you got them, they might not be expected but a little tweaking is needed to make a match fair. If the best writer won every time due to another's incompetence (this is just an example) then it wouldn't be fair. My criteria tries to make it fair.

However, by doing so, you make judging biased. It's *SUPPOSED* to be a set scale that feelings can't get in the way of. The better writer is supposed to win... That's what tournaments are about. Some of us are complaining about the points not due to low scores, but the seeming randomness to it that doesn't show a set scale being used.

Aerif · 01-25-2008, 04:15 PM

@PM if a set scale was used we'd end up with silly scores, to adjust the scale to the potential of all participants would mean that experts would get 50/50 and new writers would get 0/50 (in comparison). It just wouldn't work.

@Toph 1: The problem with the TOA setup is that I have no idea how Cesar publishes these results, the results need to be public in a way and I haven't found a single piece of published judging. Hence the real problem.

@Toph / spaceship: Er... I had no idea that was a spaceship until a few seconds ago when I went over the thread again. I realised there was something wrong the first time but I just assumed that the 'ship' was just a normal boat. Hm... oops...

As to what you said earlier about mythical/magical themes being presented with modern viewpoints and in a modern time line. It just didn't seem to fit in for some reason, I don't know why, maybe it's because both Kana and Kylista where so polite it seemed almost medeival. I guess it was the speech patterns that did it.

*Mistress Sheena* · 01-25-2008, 04:17 PM

Perhaps there needs to be separate tournaments. One for "new" writers, and the other for writers like DH, PM, and I. That way it's more "fair". >_>;

And yes, the better writer is supposed to win. And really, I prefer the "hard" way of actually describe what you think of the posts. That way, we actually know what's wrong with what we did, according to your view. Just a single vague comment statement doesn't really help. =\

Although it is my fault, that I only assigned one judge, and not 2-3, as is usually required. =P

Edit: Kana, polite? >_> How is "Damn old man" polite? XD

Edit 2: You want published results? Here. Spring 2007 R1-1: Anomaly v. Itachi Uchiha -- Dural Way Station That's a TOA round that cesar has judged. And note how he just explains his thoughts and such on their writing. No points or anything involved.

Aerif · 01-25-2008, 05:08 PM

If that's the way you want it judged I can do that. It just looks a little... I don't know what the word I'm looking for is... There's just something about it that I'm not to confident about.

Your last post seemed a bit too sarcastic. But despite the sarcasm it may be a better idea to spread competition out more, more orginisation but things need to have a balance. Like moderation or something.

Since it's easier to keep things consistent I'll judge the final RPB in a manner similar to the others, bearing in mind some of the points you made.

---

And to justifiy the politeness of Kana... Come on, how many young-men say 'DAMN YOU' in great states of anger. That's more polite then I'd expect most people to react!

Prodigal Madness · 01-25-2008, 07:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aerif

@PM if a set scale was used we'd end up with silly scores, to adjust the scale to the potential of all participants would mean that experts would get 50/50 and new writers would get 0/50 (in comparison). It just wouldn't work.

As to what you said earlier about mythical/magical themes being presented with modern viewpoints and in a modern time line. It just didn't seem to fit in for some reason, I don't know why, maybe it's because both Kana and Kylista where so polite it seemed almost medeival. I guess it was the speech patterns that did it.

So the better writers are penalized for having developed their writing skills? No offense, but just how many tournaments have you been in? I recall none, in over a dozen, that I've been in where the tournaments are done so the "lesser" participants have a shot at beating people that others know are clearly more skilled. That's not the way it works. If you get unlucky enough to be set up against a better writer, you try your best and maybe you'll win. You shouldn't have a shot at winning just because the judge feels you should. Look at Toph and DH, two of the better people, and one gets dropped right off the bat from the first round. No more fair to them, than someone that's not as skilled losing in the first round.

I didn't say anything about modern OR medieval times. I said neither should be penalized as it's not specified tournament. Meaning people with lazers and big time technology could be matched up against a peasant that learned how to use magic.

Hyzenthlay · 01-25-2008, 08:12 PM

... Judgement is overdue =[.

Anyway. I have no more to say, partially because I really dont understand PM's arguement as he seems to change it, and partially because I feel like circles are being formed. Once again I say though, 'biased' means you take a side that you believe in, you CANT be biased for stating oppinion. That would be called... Whats the word... Oppinion. NOT bias!

"to cause partiality or favoritism in (a person); influence, esp. unfairly: a tearful plea designed to bias the jury." Direct from the dictionary.

Once again, no bias was used.

And why is everybody so fixated on this?
For gods sake, get the results up and the next round going and judge the next round differently =].

Aimee.