Theory about Humans

[Testbug]

I have made theory about human beings. I don't belong to church (atheist) but this theory has doing with Bible. But here is my theory :

Adam and Eve was first peoples in earth according to Bible. But here is conflict. I tell this story form: Adam and Eve have sex. Eve comes conceive and give birth children (sex doesn't matter). But because there is anybody else in the world they have to get more childrens (again sex doesn't matter). But when Adam and Eve dies there is only their childrens in the world. So get more peoples in the world their childrens have to have sex with their brothers and sister. They gave birth and etc. etc. etc.

But now is time to my theory: Brothers and sisters shouldn't have sex with each other because their childrens will become handicapped and very stupid. But if Adam and Eve was only person in earth so everyone are relatives to each other. But because we are relatives to each other we shouldn't have sex with each others because our childrens will become stupier and stupier. With this theory Adams and Eves IQ has been very high and when we go more in future our childrens IQ will be very small.

But I want others opinions about my theory. If you have other theory send it to here. I try to answer every question about my theory if you have one.

And Mods if you want change text, be free and do it.

[Andromeda]

I do not think that mental defects appear in the first generation of inbreeding. It does take a while for inbreeding to affect the future generation, at least that is what I think, seeing as the Royalty of Europe inbred a lot and while they did produce quite a number of mentally ill leaders, not all were and it did take a while for them to appear.

But I would have to say that I have thought about this fact as well, and I think to some degree the inbreeding that has happened is the cause for diseases like AIDS a, simply because of being inbred to many times and having bad genes. When people first started I doubt that any of them had diseases, they had to be created somewhere, especially the more violent ones. Some of it is from animals, but I think we created some of them ourselves out of inbreeding.

Though according Hebrew mythology Eve was not the first wife of Adam, Lilith was the first wife of Adam. Though they did not have any children, the idea and possibility that Eve was not the only wife of Adam, could suggest that the children maybe all related to the same father, but different mothers. It is possible, unlikely, but who is to say that the Bible is 100% truth, there could be things unknown or untold because we did not need to know them.

[Gorath Sodom]

Despite your noble attempts at this theory, I forsee a lot of people posting unintelligible replies and ultimately your posting this, in the Intellectual Discussion forums of all places, will have been in vein.

As for inbreeding, while there may not be an absolute certainty of defects, it is more common in people whom share closer genes. Siblings who mate would have a higher chance of breeding a defective child than cousins. I'm not a historian, but I'm sure the European Royalty practiced inbreeding through cousins and not siblings (at least the majority anyway).

[Euclissence]

I beleive that is correct...in many cases in ancient China, cousins married and produced children, rarely with any defects. However, considering the Adam and Eve scenario, perhaps their genes were that different that it took several generations for their descendents to share similar genes?

[Testbug]

Originally Posted by Euclissence

However, considering the Adam and Eve scenario, perhaps their genes were that different that it took several generations for their descendents to share similar genes?

But if I remember right Eve was generated from Adams rib bone so they very similar genes. So they childrens have to be handicapped.

And yes that's true that Royalty of Europe are each other relatives. Thats why they have many diseases that normal peoples doesn't have much like blood diseas.

I don't know anything about Hebrew mythology, but if that Adam have other wife that doesn't matter. They are still relatives because there wasn't any mans in earth. So Adam have to be father of every child in earth.

I think that Andromeda is right about Bible. Bible doesn't tell much about Adam and Eve. They lived in paradise and they got kicked out from there. But they have get childrens because we are living. Also we can be clones from Adam and Eve but I don't believe much about that.

[Sasquatch]

While Lilith is mentioned in mythology, it has no Biblical basis.

As for incest ... yes, it's more likely to produce defects and handicaps, but that's only through recessive genetics. We all have genes that don't show up, that don't affect us, because they're recessive, and the dominant genes show up instead. These could be benign or malignant. The problem with incest is that offspring comes from parents with similar genes -- which means if you are a "carrier" of the recessive gene for, say, sickle-cell anemia, your sibling is probably a carrier as well, and the offspring between you would be more likely to take both recessive genes than would the offspring between you and an unrelated person. I've sure we've all read about Mendel and the little genetics squares and all that.

With Adam and Eve being the only two people on earth, and thus their offspring being the only handful of people on earth in charge of populating it, incest would have obviously happened. However, you've also got to remember that God created Adam and Eve as perfect -- that means no defects, no handicaps, and no recessive genes for them. So it would have taken hundreds or thousands of years for specific genes to mutate into being harmful -- and by that time, the population was great enough that mutations wouldn't affect everybody on earth, only the local population.

[Euclissence]

Wow, I could never have thought of it that way, but that sounds rather reasonable...as perfect beings, there might just have been no recessive genes, and inbreeding will only mix active genes...o_O nice.

[Sasquatch]

Well, I doubt there were no recessive genes, as then all offspring would have prettymuch the same genes, but the recessive genes for genetic defects and such, yeah. As the "defective" genes would not have been created in Adam and Eve, only mutated (or "evolved", you could say) over a long period of time and after many generations of offspring.

If it was possible to "purify" a strand of DNA -- meaning, take everything "bad" out of it, all the little hidden recessive genes that might be dangerous if matched with a partner's recessive gene -- and match it with another "pure" strand, then keep going through "generations" of "offspring" (even at a cellular level) doing the same thing with only the "offspring" of the first "pure" match, eventually, no matter how many times you did it, all the offspring would still be "pure", until some of the genes mutated.

But at this point, after human genes have had six thousand years to mutate into things like anemia and Down's Syndrome and colorblindness and male-pattern baldness and all the other genetic problems, incest is just asking for trouble.

[Edward Elric]

Hmmm. I, actually, have never believed that, incest bearing deformed children in any shape or matter. I'm not saying that I advocate it, it's just that I don't believe that.

One of my teachers also believes that, too. He compared it to the saying, "Don't play with fire, or you'll wet the bed." It's a saying that is not used as often, but still brings up an interesting point. I have never heard of any kind of connection with messing with matches and peeing your bed. So, why say that?

Because it's something we don't want kids doing in their life. How about the saying, "Everytime you jerk off, God kills a kitten." If that was true, let's be honest, there wouldn't be many kittens around, would there? So, saying that if you have sex with your siblings will produce retarded children, is the way to keep people afraid of the consequences.

Enough about that. What about the other people in the bible that Cain and Abel get married to, and eventually Seth? In the bible, it says that Adam is the man created by God, and Eve is created by his rib. Well, Does it say that Adam is the only one he created? No. It says he was the first, and Eve was the first woman. He planned to keep it that and they all live in Eden, but the snake told them of the apple, blah blah blah. Well, when he exiled them from Eden, what was stopping him from making more people for companionship, or wives, or whatever?

Nothing.

I can't say that's what he did, but thats my guess on the matter.

[Sasquatch]

Originally Posted by Edward Elric

Hmmm. I, actually, have never believed that, incest bearing deformed children in any shape or matter. I'm not saying that I advocate it, it's just that I don't believe that.

One of my teachers also believes that, too. He compared it to the saying, "Don't play with fire, or you'll wet the bed." It's a saying that is not used as often, but still brings up an interesting point. I have never heard of any kind of connection with messing with matches and peeing your bed. So, why say that?

Because it's something we don't want kids doing in their life. How about the saying, "Everytime you jerk off, God kills a kitten." If that was true, let's be honest, there wouldn't be many kittens around, would there? So, saying that if you have sex with your siblings will produce retarded children, is the way to keep people afraid of the consequences.

...actually, no, it is true. Incest produces a higher chance of children with defects of any sort. It's not just something people say to make kids afraid of sexual relations with siblings, it's actually true, for reasons I've already explained. There are also remote villages all over the world that have practiced incest for generations -- only because they have no other choice -- and the high percentages of physical and mental handicaps are evidence of this.

EDIT: And it was a serpent that tempted Eve, not a snake -- they were different at that time, and the serpent only became what we know now as the snake because of God's curse on it. But as for God creating wives for Abel, Seth, and the rest of the crew, we may never know -- they might have had spouses created for them, or they might have just gone off with a sibling. Adam and Eve had more than just three kids.

[Omega]

I think it's ludicrous frankly. In fact I think the concept of inbreeding leading to more defects in children is pretty stupid to. I mean all it is, is common genes that people have, so whether you are screwing your sister or your wife, if they both are carriers for down syndrome, I would figure your child would have the same chance of getting that regardless of the mother.

I dunno, I'm sure there is some science that can prove the theory that inbreeding is worse, but I'd like a statistical comparison to those not in inbreeding relationships compared to those who are. Because I bet the average of defects in children is pretty close.

I also completely disagree with your theory, if that is the case we wouldn't have baby geniouses, or 10 year olds knowing more about computers and technology than I do. We also would never have had minds like Albert Einstein and such. It's all percentages, and mixtures of genes, and other more non dna related aspects such as environment, and parental techniques. It's just too broad of an area of investigation to agree with a theory like that on face value without a ton or research.

[Euclissence]

Exactly..it is because when the chromosomes seperate and cross-combine, when similarties are existant...during the 'cut' process, everything happens normally, but during the 'paste', since the proteins can't identify 'another' code for that particular section, so it doesn't paste it on, thus producing defects.

Or something like that, I may be horrifically wrong.

[hellbred]

Civilzation as we know it today did not 'theoretically' stem from Adam & Eve. While they are indeed the first humans God made (and Andromeda is correct about Hebrew stating Lilith was another woman in that time, however I never read where she was Adam's first wife. I read she was the second woman to be created but valued Sin). We are in fact decendants of Noah, and his family.

Anyhow... after Cain killed Abel, God wished Adam to have another Son....Seth to take Abel's place so that Cain would not be the only seed of Adam to produce children of horrible sin. Seth separated himself from the corrupt descendants of Cain and labored, as Abel would have done had he lived, to turn the minds of sinful men to revere and obey God.

The descendants of Seth were called the sons of God; the descendants of Cain, the sons of men. As the sons of God mingled with the sons of men, they became corrupt and, by intermarriage with them, lost, through the influence of their wives, their peculiar, holy character, and united with the sons of Cain in their idolatry. Many cast aside the fear of God and trampled upon His commandments. But there were a few that did righteousness, who feared and honored their Creator. Noah and his family were among the righteous few.

Thus, God gave Noah the vision of his teachings and asked Noah to preach to men about their corrupt and sinful way urging all to follow him and turn. Of course none believed him. God has also asked Noah to build an Arc to show that he too in fact believed in what God had commanded.

Noah's family stayed in the arc for 7 days, and on the 8th day the storm broke.. and there they rest with the animals until the dove returned with the olive branch.

It is this family the humans of Earth are born from, however they are still decendants of Adam & Eve... but Noah had his family, his sons, and their wifes aboard the ship. Along the way it's impossible to know what happened, but it's stated before hand that intermarriage and breeding did occur in the time of Cain and Seth and their families. It may be only logical to think it happened with Noah, unless the brothers slept with each other's wifes.

[Sasquatch]

Originally Posted by Edward Elric

I, actually, have never believed that, incest bearing deformed children in any shape or matter.

Originally Posted by Cobain

In fact I think the concept of inbreeding leading to more defects in children is pretty stupid to.

Well, let's see.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inbred
An inbred individual is likely to possess several physical and health defects, in addition to higher incidence of inheriting a poor trait. They include:

• reduced fertility both in litter size and in sperm viability
• increased congenital disorders
• fluctuating facial asymmetry
• lower birth rate
• higher infant mortality
• slower growth rate
• smaller adult size
• loss of immune system function

http://cc.ysu.edu/~helorime/inbred.html
So how come we don't all have tons of genetic diseases? The answer to that is fairly simple, sexual reproduction, and the shuffling of alleles of genes that occurs when two unrelated individuals mate.

When that shuffling can't happen because both parents already have mostly the same alleles, the result will be inbreeding depression, if not in a given litter, then in a few more generations of such breedings.

Most studies of inbreeding are done on animals, as those are usually cases of selective breeding -- purebred pets, livestock, etc. Either way, the facts still carry over to humans.

While Cobain was correct in saying that any two people, related or n